TEMPE, Ariz. -- Women's basketball coach Charli Turner Thorne likes to use the Sun Devils' depth against her opponents.
"It's something we get a lot of compliments on, but then when it comes around to recruiting, we hear about people trying to mislead kids on how we sub[stitute]," Turner Thorne said. "People will tell them it's like hockey line subbing. They'll say, 'oh, if you go to ASU, you're only going to get to play a couple minutes at a time,' which is nonsense.
"We only do that when we are blowing teams out by 20-plus points and then I do that because we don't want to embarrass teams. At the same time, if I need to sub you at 2½ (minutes) because I want to get a certain rotation going and then get you back in for three or four minutes, we definitely will do that."
There is more method behind Turner Thorne's subbing patterns. The Sun Devils play at a frenetic pace, on offense and on defense. They like to pressure the ball the length of the court and they like to run.
"[USC coach] Mark Trakh would always describe playing us as 40 minutes of hell," Turner Thorne said. "We're relentless and our subbing helps us do it. I give a ton of credit to these teams that can do it with six or seven but we tend to do it with more. We want to pressure, we want to run you, run you, run you. We want to outwork you and have you never forget playing us."
In order to do that, Turner Thorne needs fresh legs.
"I want to sub my player before they're past their quality rotation," she said. "Whether it's three minutes or four minutes, usually that's where you get your foul or your turnover because of fatigue."
It represents a change in thinking that she adopted about five seasons into her ASU coaching career. She was using shorter benches but she always worried the Sun Devils were one injury away from a quick NCAA Tournament exit, and an injury to Sun Devil Hall of Famer Amanda Levens in 2002 cemented that belief.
"I said 'forget this, we get 15 scholarships. We want to recruit a deeper bench and systematically change our philosophy,'" Turner Thorne said. "Both of our Elite Eight years, we lost our starting point guard and leading scorer, Dymond Simon, but we still won because we had developed our players.
"We'd rather beat a team by 15 to 20 points and play our bench all the way than beat you by 30 to 35 and only play seven people and let them get stats. Our players embrace playing 25 to 28 minutes vs. 30-plus minutes. I think everybody would rather see those kids play and keep our starters healthy for down the stretch."
That's not a hard fast rule, she said. It's dependent on many variables.
"Seniors can sometimes play more minutes and we train everyone to play 40 minutes if we need to, but we don't want to do that," Turner Thorne said. "It all depends on the kids. Some have better motors. You learn your players and your team."
In the end, Turner Thorne's substitution philosophy comes down to four basic goals.
"We want to keep all our kids happy, we want to keep them healthy for the long run of the season, we want to develop our players and we never want to embarrass teams," she said.
"It's something we get a lot of compliments on, but then when it comes around to recruiting, we hear about people trying to mislead kids on how we sub[stitute]," Turner Thorne said. "People will tell them it's like hockey line subbing. They'll say, 'oh, if you go to ASU, you're only going to get to play a couple minutes at a time,' which is nonsense.
"We only do that when we are blowing teams out by 20-plus points and then I do that because we don't want to embarrass teams. At the same time, if I need to sub you at 2½ (minutes) because I want to get a certain rotation going and then get you back in for three or four minutes, we definitely will do that."
There is more method behind Turner Thorne's subbing patterns. The Sun Devils play at a frenetic pace, on offense and on defense. They like to pressure the ball the length of the court and they like to run.
"[USC coach] Mark Trakh would always describe playing us as 40 minutes of hell," Turner Thorne said. "We're relentless and our subbing helps us do it. I give a ton of credit to these teams that can do it with six or seven but we tend to do it with more. We want to pressure, we want to run you, run you, run you. We want to outwork you and have you never forget playing us."
In order to do that, Turner Thorne needs fresh legs.
"I want to sub my player before they're past their quality rotation," she said. "Whether it's three minutes or four minutes, usually that's where you get your foul or your turnover because of fatigue."
It represents a change in thinking that she adopted about five seasons into her ASU coaching career. She was using shorter benches but she always worried the Sun Devils were one injury away from a quick NCAA Tournament exit, and an injury to Sun Devil Hall of Famer Amanda Levens in 2002 cemented that belief.
"I said 'forget this, we get 15 scholarships. We want to recruit a deeper bench and systematically change our philosophy,'" Turner Thorne said. "Both of our Elite Eight years, we lost our starting point guard and leading scorer, Dymond Simon, but we still won because we had developed our players.
"We'd rather beat a team by 15 to 20 points and play our bench all the way than beat you by 30 to 35 and only play seven people and let them get stats. Our players embrace playing 25 to 28 minutes vs. 30-plus minutes. I think everybody would rather see those kids play and keep our starters healthy for down the stretch."
That's not a hard fast rule, she said. It's dependent on many variables.
"Seniors can sometimes play more minutes and we train everyone to play 40 minutes if we need to, but we don't want to do that," Turner Thorne said. "It all depends on the kids. Some have better motors. You learn your players and your team."
In the end, Turner Thorne's substitution philosophy comes down to four basic goals.
"We want to keep all our kids happy, we want to keep them healthy for the long run of the season, we want to develop our players and we never want to embarrass teams," she said.